works, ran it a few nights ago in gvg. its not a variant though? --Angelus 22:20, February 2, 2010 (UTC) hmm since its not Cruel Spear i figured i should throw up a new bar. What we can do is have a general gvg para bar, and list optional elite as cruel spear or shatter, then another optional as cry, strip ench, never surrender, etc. which would the community prefer? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Gringo (talk • contribs) (UTC). 22:21, February 2, 2010 (UTC) If they don't play significantly differently from each other like the rangers do (use the rangers as a guideline for 'significantly different'), then merge. Otherwise keep separate. I wouldn't know specifically for Paragon bars since I don't GvG. ToraenTheJanitorImage:ToraenSig2.png 22:24, 2 February 2010 (UTC) well